#252 Susan Olsen Dives Into The Brady Bunch Variety Hour

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Jeff Dwoskin 0:28

All right, Jerry, thank you so much for that amazing introduction. You get this show going each and every week and as week was no exception. Welcome, everybody to Episode 252 of classic conversations. As always, I am your host, Jeff Dwoskin. Great to have you back for what's sure to be another one of the brainiest episodes in the history of classic conversations. He has a story of a lovely lady, and was bringing up three very lovely girls. And we have one of those girls here today. Susan Olsen. Cindy Brady is joining me on the show today we're diving into the bunch and more importantly, we're going deep into the Brady Bunch variety our Susan co wrote amazing book on that love to love you, Brady's we're gonna chat all about that and that's coming up in just a few seconds. And in these few seconds, just a reminder of last week we hit the milestone 250 episodes with Burt Ward Robin from TVs Batman, follow that up with an awesome interview with Alex winter about his new documentary The YouTube effect check those out, but don't check them out until after you've checked out this radiographic episode with Susan Olsen. You know I love the Brady's I talked to Lloyd Schwartz in Episode 134 Christopher Knight and episode 226 Robbie Rist cousin Oliver in Episode 152. I've even talked to a couple of Marsh's boyfriends Michael Gray, Episode 248 Nicholas Hammond, the big man on campus and episode 284. So much Brady good as I love the Brady's and I love my conversation with Susan Olsen. I'm excited to share it with you enjoy. Alright everyone, I'm excited to introduce you to my next guest, TV icon and member of the Brady family. We love her as the youngest one in curls. Welcome to the show Cindy Brady herself. Susan Olsen.

Susan Olsen 2:34

Thank you. Great to be here.

Jeff Dwoskin 2:37

Great to have you here. When doing my research. Susan, I discovered that you had written a book you had co authored a book love to love your Brady's the bizarre story of the Brady Bunch variety hour. I got the book. Yay. I read it. I want to dive into it. Because I've had Bruce Blanche and Steve blue Stein on my show. Oh, good. So we've I've talked to both of them and Christopher Knight are briefly we talked about oh my god, that is a deep dive that goes into a lot of detail that I was not aware of.

Susan Olsen 3:09

Yeah, it's my friend had. He wanted to write a book about the variety our just because it's such a strange anomaly. And for a while though, there were a few videos up on YouTube. And people were like, Oh my gosh, I thought I was misremembering. This. This was real. It wasn't a bad dream. It really happened there was there was an actual series called The Brady Bunch variety hour. And he wanted to do a book on it. And he just wanted me to write a foreword. And then he said, Well, why don't you write all the sidebars I'd like to have you throughout the book. And I said, I have a suggestion since the whole thing was like a Technicolor overdose until full of glitter. It was such a visual spectacular. Why don't you make a coffee table book out of it and recycle. Oh, great idea. I said I know. I have a friend who's in graphic arts as I had been. I said she's better than me though. Her name is Lisa Sutton and I said get together with her create a coffee table book about this. All right, sidebars. And so I did a little bit of the graphic work picture of US law and toilet at the end, I did that. But I wrote the sidebars and what Ted ended up doing. I mean, it's a hugely Deep Dive. But in my opinion, it's not boring. It gives you an education and how television was run, how things went before things went digital. And so you had NBC the network waiting for the actual tapes of the variety hour the first episode to be delivered on Thanksgiving evening. And if they didn't get there on time, it would be dead air. Sorry, this is like Keystone Cops. This is like olden days. So yeah, I'm not wild about being older. Now, but I love when I was born because it was just right in the middle of the change and as the things went digital as I became an adult, and yeah, I got to meet a lot of people from old Hollywood. So I kind of got the best of two worlds.

Jeff Dwoskin 5:17

There was a hard time to be part of pop culture, there seems to be like, kind of just a bubble around that time where everything is still so finely remembered today, because things

Susan Olsen 5:29

aren't getting better today, that a lot of that's reason why we're finally remembering things. Even things that don't quite deserve it. I mean, I don't know when we sat down and watched all the episodes of The Brady Bunch of variety our it wasn't like it was so bad. It was good. It was just so bad. And now like, yeah, I look in I got that was pretty cool. But I got to work with all those people. And I love doing it while we were doing it. I really enjoyed it. But I made my friends promised they wouldn't watch it.

Jeff Dwoskin 6:02

It was a Sid and Marty Kroft.

Susan Olsen 6:05

Yeah, yeah. And I love Sid and Marty Kroft, his people, I adore them. They used to film Puffin stuff next door to the Brady Bunch. So I watched them film, the the title shots here where they're singing song and everything. And I love going on that set because it was colorful, visually. And I've always been an artist. It was the land that artists created. And I loved going on that set. But I was really disappointed when the show came out because aesthetically, artistically. It did all the things that a show, in my opinion, just what I don't like like an overbearing laugh track, heavy handed comedy and the style of the show. I just, I didn't like send money craft shows. But I have said that in the book. I feel terrible saying it because I love them. And I do think visually they're really they're spectacular, but I hated their shows. I used to watch Donnie and Marie so that I can go in my room and listen to Led Zeppelin it would sound so much better after watching something schlocky but okay, so that I mean, I'm very opinionated. In my opinion. I did not like Sigmar at craft shows. And so it was almost like a nightmare to be in one. But I loved it. I it was so much fun.

Jeff Dwoskin 7:29

I rewatched the pilot episode. And it is definitely of the time. It's definitely because this was born from the Donnie Murray show. Right? So you're out. Yeah, they

Susan Olsen 7:43

had a busy week and we had the pool up who was next door to their skating rink.

Jeff Dwoskin 7:47

So like you and Florence, you're to blame for the variety because you were so adorable and fun on the Donnie and Marie show. They're like, Hey, we should make a show out of this.

Susan Olsen 7:57

That's exactly what happened. Although I'd give Mike Lookinland, Maureen McCormick some credit to Yeah,

Jeff Dwoskin 8:02

the four of you. Yeah,

Susan Olsen 8:03

yes to on on the Donnie an d Marie and that is what I think it was Marty Kroft, that one, wait a minute. Let's give them their own shot. Let's this turn the Brady Bunch into a variety show because I remember being on the set and telling mark as we knew Marty Marty used to come over to the Brady Bunch set when I was eight or nine and say you want to come to puff 'n stuff. I'm like, Yeah, wonderful, sweet, nice man and Sid to, I gotta say, I love them. And we did a show that they produced at the Hollywood Bowl. Well, thanks to them. I can say that I played the bowl, then backstage at the Hollywood Bowl. And so I mean, it's great opportunities and great fun. But he came up to me while we were doing the dining Murray thing. And I said, Thank you, you know, this is really fun. This is something I wasn't expecting to do. And and he said, Well, I'm glad you're enjoying it because we have some plants. Oh, okay. Well, I was just like work. When you're a kid back then, when you become a teenager and the labor laws were the same for a 15 year old that they were four or five year old. They just don't hire you. When you're a teenager they will hot they would hire somebody who is 18 and then put them in pigtails and a pinafore and give them a lollipop. But it was really ridiculous looking because he could always spot Oh, look at the 27 year old playing well. That's just the way it was. So there wasn't work and and and do I hadn't been very clever. I hadn't figured out that I wanted to do something else with my life. So it's like great a job. Fabulous. I was 15 I think I turned 16 While we were doing it. So it was just like yeah, this is a great chance to do some work and to be with my family because there's always that

Jeff Dwoskin 9:49

right because now flash forward. We think of all the different Brady iterations the Brady's ready brides all that kind of stuff, but this one was the first one.

Susan Olsen 10:01

Yes, it was. Yeah. And the most bizarre one, the I say it's the day television took the brown acid. I mean, it's just so psychedelic. So just go and that that was the thing. I was a kid I had, I just discovered that I really loved music. And I really did not love disco. I was a prog rock girl kind of hard rock. And I was just getting into punk disco. I mean, I was one of those people that would spray paint on stop signs and put disco stop disco. Because it's so horrible. Now I think it's funky. And it's funny. But back then I was kind of serious. And I hate this. We're doing a disco version of Tootsie this week. Oh.

Jeff Dwoskin 10:47

I do encourage anyone. I mean, tick tock has like clips left and right of the Brady Bunch.

Susan Olsen 10:54

To YouTube has entire episodes that I would say this is something I because I teach acting for kids. A lot of my students don't know who I am. But some do. And sometimes they start watching the show because I'm their teacher and they like it. And so soon as they know who the characters are, I say okay, this is this is us a few years later, and this is Miss Susan when she was 15. And look at Dad look at Mr. Brady and I play for them the comedy sketch about Christopher Columbus. And Robert Reed is playing a mentally impaired Christopher Columbus and he is in hog heaven. I remember thinking Oh, please, please don't make him sing so much because he hates it. He's not good. Neither my even more comedy good or more sketches like this because he was wonderful. And so there he is dad Brady, Mr. Serious wouldn't even engage in the pie throwing scene because he didn't want Mr. Brady to lose his dignity. But here he is, is Christopher Columbus. And he's hysterical. When I show the kids, I just can't believe it.

Jeff Dwoskin 12:04

Did Robert Reed enjoy the variety hour one to do new things? But did he also personally like it that the Schwartz's weren't part of it?

Susan Olsen 12:13

That's an entirely because you everybody knows by now that Bob did not like being on the Brady Bunch. But Bob love the character Mike Brady. Bob really was Mike Brady, in a sense, and his daughter been and been married and they divorce and the ex wife took the daughter to Chicago. So Bob kind of lost his girl. And I always felt guilty. Like, we got the love that he wanted to give to her. And so we fulfilled that hole in his heart because I remember him telling me, you know, I had Karen we had Karen and I knew okay, I'm I'm a father now. I'm a father, okay. And it all sunk in because but it wasn't until one day that I had her in the shopping cart. And we were at the grocery store and I looked at what I'm a dad. And it goes that it just hit me in one moment. And so I think from the minute he had those feelings and to lose her, like he had a hole in his heart, so we filled

Jeff Dwoskin 13:14

it seems you know, just what you read is he loved all of you so much.

Susan Olsen 13:21

I'm sorry, I'm just I have to open the door. I'm sorry. No, it's okay.

Jeff Dwoskin 13:24

It's the kitten.

Susan Olsen 13:25

Everybody that knows me knows I'm a crazy animal lover. It's Bella. Bella. Say hi to everybody. Bellatrix

Jeff Dwoskin 13:33

Hi, Bella tracks. Yeah,

Susan Olsen 13:35

I slept for from Elly may Clampett syndrome, I'm very into animals. My kitties are my children. I have a, I have a healed son too. Anyway, Bob wouldn't have missed the chance to work with us. Even when Sherwood wanted us to come back. It's like, they really didn't want to work with Bob again. And I'm sure he didn't want to work with them. But when they asked him to be on Brady girls get married, he said, There's no way somebody else is going to walk down the aisle with my daughters, other than me, so and he took all of his kids to England, because he had been trained at the Royal Academy. So he wanted us not that he was going to say that we had to be actors. But if we could be turned on by what had turned him on and inspired him, I mean, we'll do that won't really have kids who want both. I turned my son on the bands and things. And so he wanted to take us to England. And to make it even more fun. We spent a week getting there on the QE to the steamship, and that was out of the goodness of his heart and his wallet.

Jeff Dwoskin 14:38

Wow. Yeah, that's incredible. Very, very

Susan Olsen 14:41

special on us a big animal lover two, very special and we get to see a side of him that a lot of people never did. I Oh, I I met a woman that had just done a play with him and I'm like, Oh, don't you love him and something wonderful and then gushing a lotus. Thank you And somebody said Miss sides like Susan, get your foot out of your mouth. He's fired her. Oh, oh, I guess he didn't have a good time with it. Oops.

Jeff Dwoskin 15:11

Tough when he had to be, I guess, right.

Susan Olsen 15:13

Yeah. And he he was difficult and it was it's a bizarre life. But to come back as an adult and then we did this horrible show called The Brady's. I got to be with Bob as an adult to see him have a hissy fit over something that was really silly, but it's just like, I want to be here. I love the cast. Eight, the producers. He was having a fit over Alice walking into the living room with a fully lit birthday cake made like there's no way she could have done that. And the wind would have blown them out. And I mean, there's, there's no way this is impossible. You cannot believe this. And that's like, Okay, this is a perfect example of suspension of disbelief. Yeah, good cakes lit because there's a prop guy back there lighting the cake. I mean, when when the loaf of bread came out of the oven, and I Love Lucy, that will put bread was about five times the length of the oven. While we still laughed. I was kind of a serious kid, though, that would question things like this. Like I always thought, why did they pick that house for the exterior? Because it's a one story house. And it's clearly not this house and the same producer and created Gilligan's Island. Why didn't everybody pack for a three hour tour? So I was kind of a literal

Jeff Dwoskin 16:34

shed. You kind of just threw me for a second because you're right. I never thought about that. They packed for a three hour tour. Oh, yeah.

Susan Olsen 16:42

The hell was right. They were chunks of money. The girls by the clothes.

Jeff Dwoskin 16:47

Oh my goodness, the only ones that

Susan Olsen 16:49

work pack were the ones that actually did live on the ship, the skip were in Gilligan. That's the way I thought as a kid, I couldn't enjoy Casper the Friendly Ghost because I needed to know how he died.

Jeff Dwoskin 17:06

That's so funny. There's

Susan Olsen 17:07

a lot of that serious thing in me. But by the time I grown up, I became much more lighthearted. And I'm just like, Whoa, look at Bob go. And he walked off the set, because nobody would support him. We're always going why

Jeff Dwoskin 17:21

was he just hypersensitive? Because he was just so annoyed with the Schwartz is that yes.

Susan Olsen 17:26

So he was looking for anything that wasn't believable. But the battles he picked when he hadn't fit during the original show, because he had the why pick up the research that this man had to do to find fault with things, actually. I mean, there was plenty of fault that could have been found easily. I couldn't help. But he added fit because he was to walk in the room when Alice and Carol are there making strawberry preserves in a little competition who's going to have the better preserves, and he's supposed to walk in and say it smells like a goddess strawberry heaven. And he comes in strawberries have no aroma when they're cooked, like, bad. Nobody in our audience knows that. And I've always meant to cook up some strawberries and see if it's true. I mean, you know, that's probably not the thing to have an issue with.

Jeff Dwoskin 18:20

That is so funny. Oh, speaking of the Schwartz's, how did they get cut out of the variety hour?

Susan Olsen 18:27

Well, sing Are you crafting very clever guys. They could have stopped it. They absolutely could have stopped it. But sure would claims because we'd already gotten into syndication sure to claims that he didn't want to stop the show and take a job away from the cast. It's also true that anything that promoted Brady was good for the franchise. So it helps with syndication of the original show. I mean, it had to have been so weird for him. And he said, and I see this thing he goes and then and they're all singing and dancing, and it's just so bizarre, and they had no right to do it. You know, he should have been a part of it if it was going to happen. But he says the same. Barney never asked for his permission, because they knew they wouldn't get it. So yeah, well, it's better to make an apology than to be told though.

Jeff Dwoskin 19:19

Got it. Okay.

Susan Olsen 19:21

Well, I mean, never really wrong.

Jeff Dwoskin 19:25

Sorry to interrupt my conversation with Susan Olsen. But we have to take a quick break. I do want to thank everyone for their support of the sponsors. When you support the sponsors. You're supporting us here at Classic conversations. And that's how we keep the lights on. And now back to my conversation with Susan Olsen. We're about to dive into fake Jan. And we're back. So one of the great things about your book was how deep you went on fake Jan. Jerry Rice. All

Susan Olsen 19:54

right. That's not even really what we created a holiday for her fake Jan day is January 2,

Jeff Dwoskin 20:02

I saw that in the book, I was excited. I put it on my calendar

Susan Olsen 20:05

that ended up with being kind of a cult like religion with all kinds of rules and regulations that I mostly came up with.

Jeff Dwoskin 20:14

That is so fine. So the idea, though, of fake, Jan, that the coining of that phrase came later, right? Like when Nick and Knight was back, it became sort of a way to hype up the Brady Bunch variety show that they're really showing.

Susan Olsen 20:28

Yes. And then the Simpsons picked up on it. And they had fake Lisa, when the Simpsons had their own variety hour.

Jeff Dwoskin 20:37

Yes. And this spin off showcase, which I dug up and watched after I saw it in the book. It's awesome.

Susan Olsen 20:43

Yeah, that's yes. Licorice wet. Yeah, everybody sings and dances.

Jeff Dwoskin 20:49

How does Eve plum feel about it now?

Susan Olsen 20:52

Wow. It's like, yeah, she she dodged a bullet. But at the time, they say she had done Don portrait of a teenage runaway that really, that should have given her the career that she deserved. And she was always very serious about acting, she want to continue as an actress. And so there was a sequel called Alexander the other side of dawn. And she was she was committed to that. And she was contractually obliged, but I think they could have maybe scheduled around it. And there was also this attitude of, I'm not going to bend too much to do this may be it's better if I don't do it. And I think once it came out, she might have been very happy that she wasn't on it if she saw it. But I know that she did. Well, she and her mother said that she cried when she saw that she was replaced, she became very emotional. I know that she certainly wanted to see us. But it was thought and it was a very logical thought that she was on to bigger and better things. And to go back and cement herself back into the role of Jan Brady could have been a bad choice. Things might not have turned out any differently. But you know, I would think that today, she might be great. If I hadn't done that darn variety show. Maybe things would have been different. Well, yeah, we never know. You never know or get typecast. But as Barry once said to me, Yeah, but how many actors get a chance to be typecast? How many have a job that's that successful? It wasn't monetarily successful? Well, in a way it has been though, because they're all the spin offs and different things. But um, yeah, sure. Did we get typecast? Absolutely. Did it pigeonhole us? Yes, it did. But who's to say

Jeff Dwoskin 22:39

so when you were trying to get roles later, be like, you know, your Cindy Brady exactly,

Susan Olsen 22:46

because the things that I would read best for would be like, yeah, hatchet murderers and drug addicts and very unwholesome roles, because that's what I wanted to do. And it was always Oh, we just can't cast Cindy Brady in that role. My agent would say, But Jan, play the prostitute. Yeah, but that's Jan, you know, Cindy Cindy's just sweet. And I was like, Well, yeah, that's the way it's gonna be. I really don't like acting that well. And yeah, I'd rather do something else. I had always wanted to be an artist. And my mother said, Oh, artists are a dime a dozen. Okay, beautiful acting. It's a much more stable career.

Jeff Dwoskin 23:30

You never know. You never know.

Susan Olsen 23:31

I just think that's so funny. It's like, oh, no, I can't you'll be a starving artists. You know, there's just too many artists. But every waiter is an actor in California. There's plenty of those too. But I guess she thought that says I had a leg up, you know, I had a foot in the door, it would be more practical what I wish I had done. And I think I wanted to do it at the time. But I just I think I also learned to please my mother, who really liked the idea of me being an actress, I should have gone to film school because I'm much better suited to being behind the camera. Writing. Editing is a passion of mine. That would have been a better way for me to go. All actors say they want to direct I wanted to do special effects. So to have an art career and get into special effects would have been much much more appropriate for me but you know, today I'd be out of work anyway. Because everything that I could do or would have done is now done by CGI computers. Although I might have gotten into the computer and learn to do it that way.

Jeff Dwoskin 24:30

You should download all the variety our batch files off of YouTube. We added them make them masterpieces.

Susan Olsen 24:38

Well, I did do one mini masterpiece, which is the song razzle dazzle. It was only the second thing I ever edited. And I wanted to have something because we were also going to sell a mockumentary about the show. And I wanted for people that didn't know that it ever existed. I wanted a quick video that would just give them a real taste of it. So I took a song that we we sang on the show called razzle dazzle, which is about being terrible razzle dazzle and deliver notice that you have new talent. And then I put in excerpts from like, every, every big celebrity guest that we had on the show. So that's actually on YouTube. It's since razzle dazzle, a Brady Bunch of variety, our true tribute. And it begins with that 70 show, because there was an episode where they were watching the variety hour

Jeff Dwoskin 25:30

between the Simpsons and that I mean, it's, yeah, it's definitely found its way into popcorn. It's funny because Bruce Vilanch was part of the Star Wars Holiday Special is Oh,

Susan Olsen 25:41

yeah, well, in the canon, that fake Jan day, when you have your fake Jan celebration, you're supposed to be watching episodes of the variety hour, but if you can't find them, then you may substitute with the Star Wars Holiday Special. No, that's

Jeff Dwoskin 25:58

totally fair. It's so funny. It was interesting, not only because of that, but Well, let me ask you a question. So Steve blue Stein in the in the book said that 85% of the audience probably didn't even notice. Do you think that was true? Or do you think they were so close to the Brady's that was just notice what that I'm sorry that Jerry replaced Eve? Oh, no.

Susan Olsen 26:17

Okay, if he sent that around me, I would have set him straight. And I love Steve love, love and adore him. But no, nobody was full. You know, Brady fans knew of who we are. Maybe some older people were I know that when I was replaced on the Christmas special. My mom's blue haired friend. Oh, we wouldn't have known that your daughter. Yeah, she just looks so much like you Mom's going. That's Jennifer Runyon that's not my daughter. But all the fans do. Steve bliss. You didn't have any interest in saying nobody would notice. But I do think that there was an attitude with the producers that we were all very replaceable. I like to say that we aren't and we weren't. And even even if there's been years gone by brainy fans kind of know what we look like. We may look very different. I think Mike looking lamb rarely gets recognized on the street. But he put somebody else in there. You put Mike in the show. Yeah. Okay, that's Bobby. They're not going to buy that somebody else is Bobby.

Jeff Dwoskin 27:23

I was always heartbroken when one of you will call her fake Cindy right. I mean, for the for the Christmas one.

Susan Olsen 27:29

We call her Christmas, Cindy because I love her. She now you're good friends.

Jeff Dwoskin 27:33

Okay, so Christmas. You knew Jerry too before she became fake Jan?

Susan Olsen 27:37

Yes, I did. We did a course all together. Yeah.

Jeff Dwoskin 27:39

So in your book, it talks about how 1500 people that was it. That must have been quite a audition for to replace Eve to take over as Jan.

Susan Olsen 27:48

Yeah. It was really strange to because Jerry says what she had to do, and I understand singing and dancing, but for the acting element. And there was so little acting. I mean, there was there was comedy to do and I would have seen making somebody do improv or something for the audition. But she I think she had to do something funny and she had to cry on cue. Well, why do you have to cry on cue for a variety hours like they got I had the role of Cindy because I wouldn't pass the audition. I don't do that. I can't just turn on the waterworks.

Jeff Dwoskin 28:23

There's not a lot of crying in the Brady Bunch. No,

Susan Olsen 28:26

I mean, there's there's a little but in variety. You know, maybe it's you have to listen to it too long. You'll cry.

Jeff Dwoskin 28:36

The craft dancers in the water follies in that pool. I mean, that was some pretty intense pool. What a synchronized swimming routine.

Susan Olsen 28:47

Yeah, and so they were all dancers who could also swim, and to do all those things while looking pretty and not having a bubble coming out of your nose. Really difficult. These guys work so hard, so hard, then they would rehearse into the wee hours of the morning, go through days where their hair barely ever dries because of doing all the water stuff. And then they're doing all the dancing stuff. And they were wonderful. They were such troopers

Jeff Dwoskin 29:15

back to Christmas Cindy for a second. So why were you on available for a very Brady Christmas?

Susan Olsen 29:21

I was going on my honeymoon. My first marriage. We had plans to go to Reggae Sunsplash in Jamaica, and I'd said I saw Sherwood at a party and he says something about well, I don't know you might want to change your honeymoon plans because we have something in store I said are knows you know, send me the script. And I read the script. I thought it stunk and but you know, it's like the power of Brady compels you. I mean, it's not like I would have said no. But then they gave me I would put this I want to be diplomatic. They were offering me like half the money that they were giving to the other two roles, which, usually we do a favored nation, so everybody gets paid the same. I've always thought if somebody is clever enough to get more than me to che, okay, you know, God bless you to get stuck to your guns, I set the price of what I think it's worth and what it's going to take to make me say yes. And so I'll say yes, if I find out, somebody else got more money. Well, you know, that's the way it is. This is what it took for me to sign the contract. And they didn't come up with plenty of good take for me to sign the contract and then knowing that they were offering the other two a lot more. It's like, Well, okay, I'm going to Jamaica. Yeah, I'd love to stick around and and eat the crumbs off the table. But I think I'll go to Jamaica instead. All right, all right. I always had sort of the fantasy sitting one out. And then when I watched it, and I saw poor Jennifer sitting at Children's table, I'm like, Oh, I feel so bad for her. But I didn't know her then we didn't meet until several years later. And we met at a Burger King. And we saw each other across the ball pit because our kids were playing and we it across the ball, it's each other and just kind of became friends. We did a podcast together for a while. We had an awful lot in common. It's kind of weird. It's very weird as she she was a horse fanatic when she was a little girl. I was too and then just a lot of like, little stupid stuff. Like I liked that. So Oh, I love that song. I didn't like so much stuff in common. I really, really like her. And I miss her. I need to catch up with her. She moved to Wyoming. She and her husband are homesteading.

Jeff Dwoskin 31:37

Oh, wow. Yeah. Okay, so fake Jan Christmas. Cindy, do you have a nickname for the Pied Marcia and the Brady's fake Marsha Marsha?

Susan Olsen 31:46

Yeah, we haven't had any contact with her we have with Jerry. Jerry will show up at conventions and things. And gosh, when we first I mean, it was because of the book that we we renewed our friendship. And then she came over to parties, and she's been around the rest of the bunch. And so we've kind of stayed in touch but we haven't seen and Jennifer to note why because Jennifer and I had every cast member on our podcast, but at Lea kind of I think she got married and had a family and you know, left the business like so many people do. I don't think people realize that. It's not that dream job. It's not the greatest job in the world. And if you're not doing it any more than you must be a failure. People leave women usually leave to go have a family. So I think that's what she did. Don't quote me on that. But we just haven't seen her. She was lovely. You enjoyed working with her, but haven't stayed in touch.

Jeff Dwoskin 32:42

I think if we have fake Jan and Christmas, Cindy, we need to come up with something other than fake Marcia.

Susan Olsen 32:48

Yeah, we do. We have to at least have a better name. Yeah.

Jeff Dwoskin 32:51

For next time. But then the Brady girls get married as well. Yeah, all of you are together again.

Susan Olsen 32:57

Yeah, we didn't all get together again, until I had a special called Brady Bunch home movies that I produced. But we didn't all get together on one row. We didn't get together on one room until still Brady I think it was called still Brady after all these years, though. So let's do by Jenny

Jeff Dwoskin 33:13

McCarthy. Oh, the 35th anniversary. course now we

Susan Olsen 33:17

did the the HGTV show,

Jeff Dwoskin 33:20

the HGTV show that's been in the news again, because they're selling it for like 5.5 million.

Susan Olsen 33:26

Yeah. I mean, somebody smart, somebody really wealthy and smart. Somebody should buy it and make it a an Airbnb. But you'd have to really, I mean, it would have to be an Airbnb for rock stars, mega wealthy people. Because you have to charge an arm and a leg, because that stuff isn't easy to replace or fix. I think some of the appliances don't work. So it's not really all that practical. But you can you can get an old washing machine and put in the you know,

Jeff Dwoskin 34:01

somebody can make that work. Yeah. How was hanging with a crew, again, the bunch and kind of recreating the house?

Susan Olsen 34:10

Well, we always I mean, I guess because as a child, I believed in magical thinking, I just always thought that there would be a reason for us to stay together, man, you know, every now every so many years, there is another reason. And so that was what I wanted. And to me, it's not surprising that life has worked that way. And when we get together I mean, we just go right back to our positions in the family. I mean, Mike and I are trying to crack everybody out. Barry is the the oldest and the one that tells us what to do. I mean, really, we are like a family. Except we don't have we get along so much better than a family because we never had to really share a bathroom. And yeah, It's that thing. It's the family love with that respect that comes that you have for people that are not your family. So it's really, it's really a great relationship.

Jeff Dwoskin 35:11

It's awesome. I mean, I, I speak for myself and everyone that I love when all of you guys get back together. I've always loved the reunion set, man, it's just so awesome. Oh, and

Susan Olsen 35:23

it gives you hope. And it, I hear you. I mean, when bands that I love get back together. Yeah, and and I think that the reason why the show was so successful is because people are a lot more psychic than they're given credit for. And I think that people knew, they knew that the love between us was real. And so when we get back together again, it just reaffirms that. I mean, really, I think the best way to put us back together again, is no scripts at all. And just let us do our thing. Have a have a camera crew, I used to get the boys to do autograph shows with me to raise money for Animal Rescue, you know, I mean, then we go to lunch, and we're all hanging out with each other. We're all still together. We're all joking around getting along great. And people want sometimes people that we really admire that we're fans of Yo, come over and go, Oh my gosh, it's so great to see you guys. And you all love each other. You're also fun, or they'll be at the table with us. And we're joking around while you guys and just as funny as you were on TV. And oh, we just love you. So good to see you.

Jeff Dwoskin 36:33

That's awesome. I've heard you on the Brady bros a couple of times. And they talk about how you are kind of like you remember everything. So let me ask let me ask you about the ken berry possible spin off Kelly's kid. Kids. Tell me about that.

Susan Olsen 36:52

I remember. It was a white boy, an Asian boy and a black boy that we're all going to be adopted by the Kelly family. Yeah, it was going to be called the Kelly kids. And I remember the black kid his name was pop. And he went on to do the new Mickey Mouse show. New Mickey Mouse Club. I think that was the group that had Lisa whelchel. It was before like the Britney Spears group. Okay, the white boys played by Mike looking lands brother Todd. And I don't remember. I didn't know the Asian boy. But anyway, it was you know, the diversity family. People wouldn't come up to me and go, What was up with that episode now? People are more savvy they go. Okay, so that was a spin up. I was a wannabe TV

Jeff Dwoskin 37:39

pilot. Yeah, yeah. But

Susan Olsen 37:41

you know, people go white. Why spend so much time on that other family? I didn't care about them. I want to see you guys. It's a spin off. I remember Ken berry being very nice. Brooke Bundy was the wife. But Ken did something that I like to remember to do to this day, when he would talk to a child, he would get down on his knees so that he was the same eye level so that he could really look them in the eyes. And Bob was like that he didn't necessarily physically get down on his knees. But he spoke to us like we were co workers. We weren't his kids. Even though we feel that daddy's spot in his heart. We were coworkers. And he respected our opinion. He talked to me I remember we discussed cartoons. And he discussed cartoons with me with the same level of respect that he would have discussed Shakespeare with somebody his own age,

Jeff Dwoskin 38:34

Robbie Rist. How did you feel about cousin Oliver?

Susan Olsen 38:36

I was thrilled to have them on the show. Because this was when I started praying for the show to get canceled. Because I was going through puberty and I was getting uglier by the minute. They didn't know what to do with me because I wasn't cute anymore. It's like yeah, bringing you're bringing mold shark jumper let him be the cute one. And you know, just have me in the background fixing a bike or something. I really wanted to blend into the Woodward and rockin and I got along really well. We stayed friends and I'm proud to say that I do believe I turned in mountain music. And it was in my bedroom with my stereo that I turned him on to Queen and some other rock bands that that inspired him to become a musician by at the time when we got our first guitars on the same Christmas and I wanted to be a musician. But Robbie's the one that practiced and really became one and he's always in like, you know, five bands. He's He's constantly busy. So I admire him a lot for that.

Jeff Dwoskin 39:38

I love Robbie. I had him on the show. And one of the things he did he was part of he did the music. He did a lot of the songs in Sharknado.

Susan Olsen 39:47

Oh yeah. Yeah, he did the main thing. Yeah.

Jeff Dwoskin 39:49

He's a good dude.

Susan Olsen 39:50

That was great. That was wonderful. It's a great song too.

Jeff Dwoskin 39:54

Yeah,

Susan Olsen 39:55

we got killed by that. I never saw it. Okay, I'm not cool. But he gets killed the Hollywood slime falls on him. I still think that's great. He was in Christmas movie that we did where we didn't play Brady's they cast us Greenie cast members as another family.

Jeff Dwoskin 40:14

Oh, blending Christmas. Yes. Yeah. So is that fine to work is nine Brady's together?

Susan Olsen 40:19

Yeah, I think gosh, we've done it all. We've made albums. We've gone on tour, leave fortress on Brady's together.

Jeff Dwoskin 40:27

Sorry to interrupt, have to take a quick break. And we're back with Susan Olsen and more Brady Bunch of variety hour with a variety hour with the singing and dancing. You sang early on, right? So you could sing. Like when I talked to Chris night, Chris and I talked, it was torture for him in the war.

Susan Olsen 40:47

I think it was very unfair to him because they made him sing solo. Because all the girls were nuts about him. And they all scream so loud, they couldn't hear him. They couldn't hear the fact that they had more rain, backstage singing for him. I mean, Chris's microphone was off during most of our concerts. And I think it put a wedge between Chris and music that didn't need to be there. And I feel bad about it. I remember when he quit the band. And his last show was at the Minnesota State Fair, Tony Orlando and Dawn open for us. And it ended up being our last show too, because we didn't go on and do anything. There was the Brady three that we rehearsed for we got costumes. And I think once again, I prayed had made a miracle. I said, Please God, don't let us take this on the road. It's gonna be too embarrassing. And we never got a single gig. I got Panwar,

Jeff Dwoskin 41:46

power of your thoughts I was doing that I

Susan Olsen 41:49

as much as I love touring, I absolutely love touring as part of why I wanted to be a musician later, I love being on tour. But I was hoping that we could do real rock. And mom would say, oh, you know, she dangled carrot in front of me. So when you guys get past your image, you'll be able to do more hard rock. And so I loved it. And I kind of feel bad that Chris was breaking up the band. But then when when they got just the three of us, it was me and Mike and II, we got together. I thought it was really, really lame. And we really embarrassing. And this was one of those things that I had to do because mom made me like, You got to let this happen.

Jeff Dwoskin 42:30

Oh, man. So important question Do you have? Do you have one of the original kitty carry all dolls,

Susan Olsen 42:38

the original mass market it in the box, which the box I hear is worth a lot more than the doll because it's very rare. But the real originals? Part of the reason why I disliked that doll so much. It's because she weighed 10 or 12 pounds, because she had a plaster of paris head. And every time the prop master handed her to me, they'll drop it. Don't drop her got to hang out real time. And it's an it's that though. Yeah. Those of be worth tons of money. There were two of them. And they are missing because I know some people that do archives at Paramount like now those those were stolen quite a while ago. And perhaps they were lost because they'd never shown up on the black market. Or maybe they dropped them and they shattered that's possible.

Jeff Dwoskin 43:24

Right? Ah well never know. We may never know. Well.

Susan Olsen 43:29

Yeah, mine is in very good shape, though. Because I let my niece play with her. But I got the box. I've got the doll.

Jeff Dwoskin 43:36

Mint in box. That's not meant to say like mentor box.

Susan Olsen 43:42

Yeah, it used to be Gosh, 20 some odd years ago is like 300 now i I'm sure it will be at least 1000 I don't know. But I hear that the plaster Paris head ones would be worth a good 30 to 50,000

Jeff Dwoskin 43:56

Wow. All right. Maybe that's the next Brady get together CSI kitty carry on. You guys.

Susan Olsen 44:05

I'm sure they got broken. I'm sure that because they they would have found their way they would have come to the surface.

Jeff Dwoskin 44:12

I'd say you said 12 pounds. I gotta say I think your book, The bizarre story. The Brady Bunch variety our is 12 pounds. It's a heavy bag. It's a heavy

Susan Olsen 44:22

coated stock for printing in color because gotta have a lot of color. I tell you greater. And you know,

Jeff Dwoskin 44:30

you mentioned earlier and I'll tell you if you if anyone listening is is really interested in TV history. This is about 300 pages of all goodness, meaning I don't mean it's not like 20 pages, and then 50 pages of photos just to make up bulk. This is like all deep dive if you're into learning and like some of this diving into pop culture. This book is incredible. Incredible.

Susan Olsen 44:54

Thank you. I agree. I think Ted did a wonderful, wonderful job and then we had people like like I, I mean, I participated in some of the interviews and I told Tim like, Don't enter new Bruce without me. I want to talk to him. I love Bruce Lynch and Brutus is one of the smartest people I've ever met. And the whole reason why he was on our show in the Star Wars Holiday Special was because he was told that his resume had just too much good stuff on it, he needed to have a few duds. And so when he heard, there was a Brady Bunch of variety always that fits the bill. And the Star Wars Holiday Special, of course, but Bruce is brilliant. I love them. I ended up on a web series called Child of the 70s because the Creator came to me so one of those web shows where nobody gets paid. They'll do it because it was a really fun gasp really wonderful crew and cast. In fact, I asked him, please make me regular on the show. Because I really enjoyed this. The producer came to me and said, I'd like you to do a cameo. You get to play Bruce avalanches boss, and so I was gonna get to cuss him out. Because I walk in and he's molesting one of his clay will. We're an agency. I was the head agent. He was an agent. So I was his boss. And he was trying to molest one of his clients. And I read him the riot act and threatened to fire him like, yeah, I want to do that. And I ended up on the show,

Jeff Dwoskin 46:24

Bruce Vilanch is awesome. And Bruceville lanch was one of the very first interviews I did on this podcast. And I was so excited to talk to Bruce Vilanch just because I just thought he was a brilliant writer and all that and, and then I ended up reaching out to someone else. And they're like, Hey, I'd love for you to be on my podcast. And they're like, Oh, well, if this is good enough for Bruce Vilanch, it's good enough for me. It was just You didn't have to do it. I mean, I was nothing. I guess today I had just started. So I'm always always thankful to Bruce Vilanch for that. Well, that's why

Susan Olsen 46:59

a child in the 70s, too. It's like, Oh, I get to work with Bruce. It's good enough for Bruce. Yeah, I get to cuss him out. Yeah.

Jeff Dwoskin 47:08

So many amazing stories. Susan, thank you for hanging out with me. I'm I'm kind of impressed. We didn't even really talk about the core Brady Bunch.

Susan Olsen 47:17

me enough. Yeah, Brady reboot stuff that. Yeah. And that was something when I did pretty much home movies. That was something I wanted to emphasize. I produced that. But I didn't have as much creative say, as I would have liked to. And that was one of the things I wanted to really illustrate. We had a cartoon show. We added variety. We had albums, we had concert tours, we came back for this TV movie, then there were feature films, it's like, there were so many entities of Brady, and I don't think that most of the public even the people that were hardcore fans are aware of just how many things there were.

Jeff Dwoskin 47:58

Yeah, the Brady kids, I do know that like three of them had like issues and then like their voices got replaced. Yeah, met all of it. And that must have been a thing in the 70s. Because Happy Days did that too. Or they had the happy days gang cartoon. They do a cartoon version.

Susan Olsen 48:13

Yeah, it was. It was a contract thing. Now remember, I thought that they had deliberately cast unflattering voices particularly for Marcia because she was very upset. I just remember like her. Her character kind of sounded like a dullard like they deliberately made it unflattering.

Jeff Dwoskin 48:35

Not fair at all. And then the Brady Bunch movie which I know you're seeing got cut from it. If you were a reporter for The Daily Tatler.

Susan Olsen 48:45

No, I was actually a mail man mail, and Cindy tattles to me, but I'm like the gossip. So I'm the mail woman postal worker who is up on all the dirt on everyone. My cameo and Mike looking lands. Marinas hinged on the subplot with the dip Meyers and they cut the whole subplot out. I'm glad they did. It wasn't funny. The movie is so much better without it. I think the movie is really good. And I can enjoy it more if I'm not in it.

Jeff Dwoskin 49:18

i Well, I'm sorry that you weren't in it. And I do agree. Of all those movies mean like the TV reboot type movies. The Brady Bunch is by far the best one. I mean, the original The Brady Bunch movie and the scene that cracks me up the most. And I can watch it. You know, there's certain scenes you can watch over and over again. This scene where Davy Jones is singing at school, but all the moms start fawning

Susan Olsen 49:45

from high school and I was sitting in a theater watching I've been flown to New York to do publicity for the movie and we're sitting in the theater and first of all, that's our high school because they don't have a tab time like those are our tables and And then when that happened in the first place, that version of girl is fabulous. And the only thing that's different is baseline bass player. So I really appreciated it. I knew most of the band performing behind Devi. And so I was going that's like the women in the audience and that was so cute when they rushed the stage it was adorable. And that was like the come together moment of that movie to me. And at the time, I was producing Brady Bunch home movies. So we were having there was another production that was in conflict and bro, it was up to me to kind of rally all the Brady's together to do my show. And just memories of that song. And that moment in the theater kept me going. Like, that's the essence. That's the essence of Brady. And of course, daily. I love him. Yeah, he was a wonderful guy.

Jeff Dwoskin 50:52

He was the Monkees is one of my faves. Yeah, that that scene is just incredible. I'm so excited that that's one of your favorite scenes, too.

Susan Olsen 51:00

I love it. And I would, I got the soundtrack. And I would listen to that version of girl. And you know, it would renew me and they'd go yes, we're gonna do my special and, and and then Barry wanted very long to get like looking land playing keyboards and me on bass. What are these conventions while he sang? And I was like, do girl, but do the grunge version of girl it's really, you know, it's really good song and I love the baseline. And he's like, Man, I didn't want to do a Davy Jones song. And I you know what? I can't blame them.

Jeff Dwoskin 51:33

Speaking of conventions we met in 2011 at the Motor City Comicon. I was waiting for you to recognize me. I'm kidding. No, I'm kidding. I'm joking. No, but I have your picture. Like we are eight by 10. You and Mike I met you and Mike and I have a picture of you and Mike and me together. Susan, this was incredible. I can't thank you enough. It was a blast hanging out with you.

Susan Olsen 51:59

My pleasure. I'm sorry. Thank you for jangling Sir the colleagues I have to cancel hate each other. I have to go on Facebook and get more advice. I'm supposed to be a cat expert. And I didn't know what to do about this. They can't stand each other

Jeff Dwoskin 52:14

one cats is hard enough. We were I had a cat and a dog. And they loved each other I think because I had the dog first and then we brought the cat in and they loved each other and then my dog passed away. And you in the cat never liked the new dog ever.

Susan Olsen 52:31

I'm gonna send you a video of my cat and dog that loved each other.

Jeff Dwoskin 52:36

Oh, I want to see that. Thank you. Yeah, your wouldn't do it to us and thank you so much again. I look forward to CSI kitty Kara can carry all and, and all the next steps in your Brady adventure and whatever you do next. All right. How amazing was Susan Olsen if you love the Brady Bunch and you love the Brady Bunch variety hour or you want to fall in love with it, check it out on YouTube, but also get love to love you Brady's the bizarre story of the Brady Bunch variety hour. It's one of the best deep dives I've ever read. It's amazing. Also check out all the great other Brady Bunch content on the podcast. Also Bruce Vilanch we talked about it from Episode 17. That's a really old episode and Steve blue Stein episode 61 Couple oh gee guests on the show back when it was called the Jeff Dwoskin show. So you can check those out. We talked about the Brady Bunch variety hour in each of those episodes as well. And also Joyce Bula fonts episode 216. She talks about how she was actually cast as the very first Carol Brady so much Brady goodness on classic conversations. Well, with the episode over can't believe it. Huge thanks to Susan Olsen had such a great time chatting with her about the bright days. And of course, thanks all of you for coming back week after week. It means the world to me, and I'll see you next time.

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