#278 Behind the Lens with Brenton Spencer

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Jeff Dwoskin 0:29

thank you so much for that amazing introduction. You get the show going each and every week and this week was no exception. Welcome, everybody to Episode 278 of classic conversations. As always, I am your host, Jeff Dwoskin. Great to have you back for what's sure to be a classic conversation for the ages. TV director. Cinematographer Brenton Spencer is here to share stories of behind the camera and in front of the camera magic, the flash SCTV the corries This episode has it all. And that's coming up in just a few seconds. And in these few seconds. The legendary Eric Roberts joined us last week. So many great stories do not miss that conversation. But first Do not miss my conversation with Brenton Spencer are talking a lot about the CW is the flash where he spent a lot of time going back and forth in history. 21 Jump Street at CTV so many great stories. Oh, first blood so many great stories coming up right now. All right, everyone, I'm excited to introduce you to my next guest award winning television director and cinematographer our resume which boasts the flash Stargate Atlantis 21. jump straight. Welcome to the show. Brenton. Spencer.

Brenton Spencer 1:52

Well, thank you for that intro. Jeff. I feel like I should be in the chorus line or the you know, the Warner Brothers Saturday morning cartoon lineup where I'm marching along with this is it the night of nice, great intro, so I appreciate that.

Jeff Dwoskin 2:06

Oh, hey, well, I'm excited to have you have such a huge careers and resume. I know you're from Canada. So it wasn't a huge surprise that your early work was with SCTV I guess I was most surprised to see that they had a cinematographer only because I didn't even know they had a budget

Brenton Spencer 2:25

SCTV was a highlight of my career and anyone associated with it. There was so much brilliance in SCTV and I shot I was one of a number of DVDs but I shot the Film Unit. Everything else was on tape or video and the Film Unit included the scary previews Dr. Tang, scary previews and the Libby Wilson documentary TV series. I shot some classics like Cujo to officer and a Gentile which is just classic with Andrea Martin. And Martin Short. I didn't really watch SCTV before I started, I'd worked with the director John Blanchett on a feature film. And John was the brains behind the 10 seasons of of SCTV he was able to pull all those mazing talents, John Candy, Joe 30 cetera and he was able to pull all them together and we met on a on a movie I was a camera operator. He was the DP and he asked me if I wanted to shoot a CTV and I was familiar with it as this iconic show but I had never really watched it. I was assigned to go out and shoot these Libby Wilson documentaries within here Martin and pin I thought it was the real deal. I thought this is known this is a serious and it this was 20 years before the internet so I wasn't able to dial up and get the background. So I was out there fully expecting that this was a legitimate documentary. It's amazing. Oh, it's only the beginning of my manager prizes.

Jeff Dwoskin 3:58

I mean, that cast was insane. I mean, what Eugene Levy Andrea Martin Martin Short, which, which seasons were you in? Specifically? Who would notice? These? Oh, that Okay. Okay.

Brenton Spencer 4:09

Susan, tell them where they moved back to Toronto.

Jeff Dwoskin 4:12

So many of them today are still so prominent Catherine O'Hara, Andrea Martin Martin Short, Eugene Levy. I just like

Brenton Spencer 4:20

look at the success of shits Creek. I mean, that's SCTV red ducks.

Jeff Dwoskin 4:26

Oh, yeah. Yeah, that's next generation right there.

Brenton Spencer 4:30

And then any Christopher Guest movie has the CTV ensemble cast, whether it's Best in Show was a classic and waiting for Guffman that featured the you know, the cast so strongly if they're CTV cast.

Jeff Dwoskin 4:43

Yeah. Eugene Levy, and Catherine O'Hara and all those movies. Yes, incredible. Those are some of my favorite movies Best in Show is probably I could watch that over and over and over again. Oh, my goodness.

Brenton Spencer 4:57

I was talking to someone the other day and I said knee jerk reaction Best in Show was my favorite. And then for one second as the synapses fired, hey, what about waiting for Guffman? I loved it still have spinal tap. And I had my own Spinal Tap moment. And was it prior to me watching spider Spinal Tap? No, it was after spinal tap. But it was a classic Stonehenge moment where I was hired to shoot the second unit of of or the digital photography, a movie had been been shot. Steve Foley actually started it, it was called high stakes. Peter Simpson who produced the prominent movies was most a producer of it. Ray Saggar was another producer and Ray was played the Wizard of Gore in the Herschel Gordon Lewis classic. So this was, you know, just behind the camera. It was the star cast. But anyway, my stone edge moment was we had to blow up Hitler's cave where all these kinds of artifacts at the heroes had been searching for. And the cave, the real cave that was shot in the film featured, you know, ceiling probably 15 feet high. And it was 3040 feet feet across the center. And we had to blow this up. So miniature was built. And I said to be successful in the miniature the skill, we have to keep the scale as high as we can, obviously one to one would have 15 foot ceilings, but I said, if you can bring it down to like, 30% or something like that, if I could get, you know, nine foot and well, we can afford that. Okay, six feet can give me Yeah. Okay. And what you did at high speed was slow everything down, we'll put a lot of miniature rocks and things like that. I said to the, to the model builder. So how high is it? And he said, No. And he was standing up and he featured a height above that, and it's about six feet. So okay, okay, this will work well, but I want to see it. So we go to the studio, but we're going to the studio, it's in a residential part of Toronto. I thought, Okay, well, maybe it's in a refurbished garage or something like that. And then we start walking out the back stairs of the tenement, that are, you know, fairly wide enough for your shoulders like that. Okay, well, maybe built it in modules, you know, and then we'll be assembled somewhere later. And then we get in, we walked down the narrow hall hallway in this Artist's Loft, and we walk into this tiny little apartment, and but he was right, it was it was about that tall, but it was sitting on a desk that was about four feet high. So we, this

Jeff Dwoskin 7:14

I, I think I think there's a whole generation of people that learn the difference between feet and inches, because of that stone has seen in spinal tap.

Brenton Spencer 7:27

No, absolutely. And the dangers of getting through airport security. Yeah, you know, with cucumbers and tinfoil. And I think every filmmaker has had, I wonder what Spielberg's was on the on Jaws, it was probably when he first realized that the shark did not work at all,

Jeff Dwoskin 7:45

which turned out to be the biggest blessing for that film. Because his workarounds for that turned it into a classic, I guess, when you're handed lemons. I when I had Ed Begley Jr. on the show, and I introduced him when I went my opening introduction, was I introduced him as the drummer from spinal tap.

Brenton Spencer 8:06

One of the drummers Yeah,

Jeff Dwoskin 8:08

I think he was the first one that dyers, any other funny SCTV stories, I got to spend some time with Dave Thomas once in chat his ear off any particular it sounds like you got to work a lot with Andrea Martin, who was just wonderful.

Brenton Spencer 8:22

Yeah. Andrea, and then, you know, Martin, short, Eugene Levy, really everyone it was an ensemble cast, and they all move through, but we were shooting a scene 170 the eyepiece, and no, we didn't have a lot of money. It was a one to one ratio it had to be so usually you'll have feature film when sometimes has well 20 pending or the director has 21 ratio. So you know, as you know, you should have 20 minutes, but you're only one minute is going to end up but we had a one pretty close to one to one ratio, and the eyepiece totally falls off the camera. And I had been you know, operating I was a DP and the operator had been, you know, following everybody fairly loose lens fairly, you know, wide lens, but not super wide. I had all the people the eyepiece falls off the actors, and I think was Joe Flaherty reacted to the eyepiece coming on and he stays in character at he makes his comment about how are we ever going to you know, get get this movie, maybe we're doing a scene within it within a movie is that the eyepiece is coming off of the camera. So it's sometimes we would just run out of daylight, and I remember getting all the vehicles together, turning on the headlights. It's a bit of a mythical approach, but we actually did that on at least one occasion on SCTV just to get enough light in there, but just the Kismet and the craziness and the respect and the love. These are amazing actors and everyone knew that this was gold that this was iconic, legendary work we were doing. Jewel Hall Omar was the costume designer. He was also the lead of the jewel Hall admire dancers who had You would see them in the background and Mike McMurray was one of the leading technicians on the show and he gap my second unit is great DP DP or final conflict before I came on, but Mike had this crazy crazy little jig that he would do and Martin Short you know, sort of copied it as a as that Ed Grimley kind of kind of move pay tribute to make a course. Yeah, just wonderful comic opportunities and the environment that we were in allowed for so much creativity. It was all special.

Jeff Dwoskin 10:35

Amazing. That was one of your early one of your first like big resume staffers.

Brenton Spencer 10:40

Yes, I had worked as an assistant and an operator on the second unit of First Blood prior to that as a DP credit. Yeah, that was my first big standalone

Jeff Dwoskin 10:54

credit right first blood as in Rambo First Blood.

Brenton Spencer 10:58

Yes, yeah. Oh, that was 1980

Jeff Dwoskin 11:01

Now that's a movie.

Brenton Spencer 11:04

Oh, yeah. And I have a laugh over the years have been working on on different series and and I would read a writers description of it's there was said, you know, Rambo style or Rambo in this scene in the tunnels as if Rambo on a cliff face. And I reserved for all of those moments. And I think, you know, I would tell the writers Yeah, I think I know, I'd think I know exactly what you need.

Jeff Dwoskin 11:31

You're like, I got this. I got Yeah. That's so cool. I'm dying to ask blown away working with the corries, Haim and Feldman. When I grew up, they were like, everywhere. I just wanted to shout them out. That was one of your direct tutorials. And Nicole Lagarde. That was that's like key late 80s, early 90s start on right there all the animal online.

Brenton Spencer 11:56

Yeah, that was, again, Peter Simpson and Ray Saggar. From the prom night series, they produced for my rookie appearances, a director, it was quite the ride. But I found these are three really wonderful, wonderful actors. And, you know, it's a tough burrowed on Hollywood, especially when you're brought into it as a, as a child, I will see how anyone can expect that a child performer can transition wholly in terms of mental health, well, maybe, maybe it's a lack of or a struggle with or whatever. But it is, is it a requirement to be in show business as certainly we can use those issues, you know, in those struggles and those obstacles to create, but I worked with those three actors really early on, they're so great, so talented. And yet, you know, it was impossible for them, I think to to continue on and carry through the rest of the career, that kind of talent that they they have. I love them dearly. They, they were a handful. While

Jeff Dwoskin 13:02

that would have been when they were young and hot. They kind of own the world a little bit at that moment. So I can I can imagine it would have been because that was like their heyday. But you're right about kid actors. I mean, I for every Neil Patrick Harris or Jodie Foster, there's a million other stories that didn't end that well. Or it's rough. And it's like, I was talking to Christopher Knight, Peter Brady. And I was like, if you had had kids, if you had kids, would you have let them act? And he was like now never. I think a lot of I think kid actors feel that way about kids. You know, like, trying to especially from that time frame, it might be better now. I'm not sure but even like that Brooke Shields documentary, where she's reflecting on everything. And it's it's just a lot of it's heartbreaking. You

Brenton Spencer 13:48

know, I'm not gonna suggest that anyone lost a childhood but those childhood moments are so precious. They're distilled a minute in childhood time is you know, an eternity and as you age don't even think about the minutes anymore but as a child you you delve in your explore you take apart you dismantle every moment because been presented to you knew the first time and that's what took Korean Korean Nicole did extremely well. And subtly, too, but you know, they're they're getting fired out of a circus cannon in Hollywood. And how much is that? It's a lot of it's like Kismet? I guess? I don't know.

Jeff Dwoskin 14:26

Brandon, how did you how did you get started? When did you know that a Maytag or fi direct directing was going to be your thing. What inspired you early on that led you on this path?

Brenton Spencer 14:37

I mean, I love questions about the origin of you know what we do? For me the origin was just when I was a kid, I don't know. Less than 10. Anyway, my uncle was going to university and sent me a bunch of English literature books from first year he was there, em kick around and that opened them in there to be something like a cool to Shakespeare is something underlined and I knew that this is this is important and so very early on a good friend of mine and I, we, we would write, we want to write a novel about whaling. Neither one of us had even heard about Moby Dick at that time, but you know, so we were always interested in creating I was taking a creative writing course at university and the structure set and you want you know, I've got some film and camera, you know, movie camera, you can make a film of, if you like, into some money for developing anyone interested in shot my head I was only one shot this little pixelated thing where I'm moving clay pieces around, you know, time lapse, Fe to frame you move it every two trim, you move it, and he sent it away in the mail that comes back from Kodak. But you got to go somewhere to pick it up. And I remember I couldn't wait. I'm in there. It was at a drugstore. I mean, the light i that get it and I couldn't wait, I opened the it was super eight. And I started pulling it quickly through my identity and threaded up motion picture I mean it projected for but just the idea, all of a sudden they're in motion, and captivated me to had me immediately. And some people say film, when we watch a film with there's a certain amount of hypnotism played out. Well there. It was magic. And Abracadabra. And I was hypnotized totally at how these things move in a different plane than me standing there. You know, I've got this film, and then there's a separate world going on there. So we always had monetized. I could smell it too. In those days.

Jeff Dwoskin 16:34

Have you ever shot film Super Eight or anything now like that now?

Brenton Spencer 16:37

It's even super alien. There's a smell that comes out of that box at Kodak. I don't know what Fuji smelled like I was shot a lot of Fuji. But anyhow, just the smell and the aroma of the chemicals of the celluloid base. So there's an oral factory thing going on there, too. There's a visual thing. So I there's a tactile thing.

Jeff Dwoskin 16:57

No, I totally understand. I mean, I I'm not that specific. But I mean, I am from the 35 millimeter camera world where you know, you take you usually have to take pictures, and then drop them off. And days later, they will be ready for you. And then one hour photo was quite an invention at one point. It's funny when you think back on that.

Brenton Spencer 17:19

Oh, yeah. And even people would stand around the early one hours and look at anonymous photographs of somebody else being that were printed and would remember.

Jeff Dwoskin 17:28

Yeah, I remember learning early on, I don't take pictures of things you don't want other people to see.

Brenton Spencer 17:33

Yeah, no, that's all remember that more and more. Do you remember also when there was a little Brownie camera or a small camera that was the host camera? And people would people come to a birthday party or Christmas that said we please send me a copy when they come back. In other words, when you pack it when you shoot everything on the roll, and you send it away, and it comes back in the mail, and there'd be a whole year there'll be well for maybe a most what? 36 exposures, and there'll be a whole year on there. And now we take pictures, almost incidentally of what's going on, like diseases. And do we ever really look at them again? I mean, we posted on that it's gone. That nostalgia looking at an image.

Jeff Dwoskin 18:14

Yeah, I mean, I was looking at my photos on 57,000 photos, which is an insane number. I mean, that's forever right but but you're right it used to be you meticulously would take photos and then sometimes when you took that film Man You didn't even really fully know everything that was gonna be on it. And then of course you had to make that decision would you like Britain would you like single prints or double prints? Yeah but yeah, and then it comes back yeah, now you look at it you don't like it? Yeah, someone's blinking you know you move redo it Yeah, it's it's a whole new world.

Brenton Spencer 18:51

Well, it's the same when we shot him film. No, you can roll on and on and on and directors do and then there's some efficiencies in you can only roll around 11 minutes or so in 35 millimeter. That was the 1000 foot bag at a cost but didn't originally originally could you say it keep rolling thumbs cheap until it didn't become cheap anymore. And then the producers be clutching your pearls as they hear the high speed camera like roar up to 120 or more depending on what you're shooting right. And now we shot one series on the flat one episode on the flash arm and Kevorkian great visual effects supervisor is visual effects supervisor in the first six seasons seven seasons of The Flash, he directed an entire episode of the flash out 120 frames. And that's quite an accomplishment everyone. Just the data alone.

Jeff Dwoskin 19:47

That's incredible. How did you become part of the flash? Just going by IMDb which sometimes can be wrong, but you've you've been a part of at least a third of all the episodes is cinematographer over 50 or so and Directed rugs of war in the last season, I wanted to ask you about that Krembil relay if you had the conflict, delish. She had the recipe that they're making in the beginning, you know? Yeah. So how did how did you land the flash gig?

Brenton Spencer 20:15

Well, I have worked with the Jaypee Fedun. In the past, Kim miles, was moving on. He shot a movie, a feature film, actually. And so there was there was an opening. I'd worked with JP before and how would you like to do the flash?

Jeff Dwoskin 20:32

Were you a fan of The Flash, either I get to the show or like just the character itself or superhero genre.

Brenton Spencer 20:39

When I was a kid, there were two groups, DC and Marvel. I was a DC guy, just because the first box of comics I got my mom went to a sale at someone's house. And this would be, I don't know, writing 60 or something. The woman said, Oh, my sons have gone to college. Would you like to comics? Remember this 1960 boxes, and one of the kids was a fan of Batman. And I don't know where they are now. Maybe in the Smithsonian? Who knows. But I was intrigued by Batman. And the rest of the superheroes have inhabited. My neighborhood were Marvel and I had this is my first DC Superhero was Batman. And these guys are like real. These are sweat and blood. Super. I know tactically Batman's not a superhero. But these were visceral characters. These characters that were were more like me than marble, two different worlds two different camps. I like I like the edginess of the of the DC world without man in particular. Barry Allen was always cool because he's fast as guy, but I was a bad guy.

Jeff Dwoskin 21:45

Sorry to interrupt, had to take a quick break. In the meantime, ponder whether you're a DC or Marvel person. I'm mostly Marvel. I grew up Marvel's Spider Man kind of guy. But I can appreciate a good DC let me know what you are. Tweet at me comment, whatever. But in the meantime, thank you for your support of the sponsors. When you support the sponsors, you're supporting us here at Classic conversations. And that's how we keep the lights on. And now back to my conversation with Brenton Spencer. Did you watch the flash with John was the ship when? Back in late 80s?

Brenton Spencer 22:19

No, I didn't in what what year? So that room was at 88? No, it was that 86 to 80? No,

Jeff Dwoskin 22:26

it came out around the same time as Batman 89 that Michael Keaton's Batman, so I had to been like late 80s.

Brenton Spencer 22:33

No, I didn't. But I was Batman, huge fan of the the OG Batman, you know, the original. mean, that was one of the visual shifts in my thinking. So when did Batman come out? I'm gonna say 6465. And all of a sudden, there, there is this I'm introduced to this world. Like, up till then I was straight up, you know, World War two movies, cowboy movies, John Wayne, very beginnings of Clint Eastwood and sort of an alternative version of Hollywood, and then Batman. And this new sort of thing. It was, it was campy, you know, in the costumes, and I wasn't introduced to the kind of humor and the kind of kind of setup of that it led to an introduction to or to me visually, for some reason to look, Lichtenstein and Andy Warhol. It gave me this huge appreciations at felt like it allowed me to transition from black and white in my thinking in the color. And then after that, Bridgeview you know, Bridge over the River Kwai, what knowledge that was released a year now was, yeah, it was released. Uh, right around the same time. Yeah. So, which was the saturation of color? Lawrence of Arabia.

Jeff Dwoskin 23:42

Right. So you take over CW as the Flash cinematographer, was able to put your stamp on it, like what was the what were you able to kind of bring to the table? Or did you need to kind of stay you know, do they build this world and you kind of had to learn it and kind of stay in that.

Brenton Spencer 23:59

So I showed up in The Flash season four episode one episode for a one directed by Glenn winter, Glen had had deep heat the arrow and at ADP, the pilot of the flash as well and it transitioned into directing. But Glen and I went way back as matter of fact, when he was in university, I was sort of visiting we'll call it lecture when I come and talk to everyone about cinematography and became friends with with Glenn while he was still a student. And when he graduated, I brought him on to onto a TV series or a pilot I was shooting for Stephen Cannell call the hat squad. It's turned into a TV series, but So Glen, and I had a very interesting relationship. He just showed me my way around the flash and encouraged me to be really bold and try stuff and one of the things to do that was to get Glenn introduced me to this 10 millimeter Zeiss lens and normally, the super wide angle lenses will do storage tanks. This lens really reduces the distortion. So you can put it in places in rooms and capture this dimension that you don't really get. So I think bringing in the 10 mil and leaning into the 10 mil lens, we transitioned from tungsten lights, and HMI is to probably 90%, digital, and all of our cues, all of our color, temperature, all of our intensity was all run through, you know, a computer program, all the lights were programmed, we could change the lights and the color on the fly. And I think we were the leading edge on that kind of technology. The gaffer is Jessie key, who was really leading that that way of of digital lighting, I think it's the influence of the digital lights, knowing not to be afraid of the 10 mil. And when, you know when the producers saw the success when Eric Wallace was the showrunner and Season Five onwards, he came up and directed one and wanted to go wide and I in addition to the 10 and it was 10 millimeter for the next four seasons. And working together with the art director to get a lot of reflective, Jenny Wilson was a production designer and I wanted to bring as much reflective material onto the sets to have we had these huge sheets of acrylic that we would lay along floors at a speed lab you can see in really strongly in season eight and nine but throughout season 456 all the way there was a wonderful show that I shot called entering flash time, Greg Jackson was the director, we built a set out of just acrylic walls and probably one of my favorite episodes in the years of the flash entering clash time really strong episode really really got heavy into high speed in my time there I think it was the watercolor lenses working with the art department and and special effects to get wet downs everywhere. Sometimes interior sometimes we will wet down areas of the of the speed lab, and you have to be cautious when you when you're wet down a set because it's not built for it and there's either not they'll slowly fall apart. So you don't make a lot of friends in production when you do that. And so we started building sets that were waterproof, and atmosphere steam and smoke and having characters especially superheroes at high speed moving and appearing through atmosphere and and fog just the silhouettes on and one great example is when Black Lightning a red lightning was introduced in the 803 at the very end it's almost the penultimate beat when you see her coming through to the fog in the midst and originally that was a visual effect going to spend a lot of bucks to create that and we could do it practically this was a super bonus. So to create an image the people that I relied on work special effects and of course the you know the camera department but the art department as well the neuron camera grip electric crew was so so important and working with props too. I loved working with a lot of force perspective and they would build me oversized cue balls you know this big that I could put GoPros on are going to put a GoPro on on a queue and hit an oversized cue ball so I was I was always working with with force perspective in an oversize pockets for the balls to fall in oversize stuff chess pieces. So the one in the in the foreground might be the size and the pod in the background and be a foot Hi love that Kayla Compton directed 911 And we created these force perspective bullets because the camera just can't get everywhere. So you build things oversize and I think I brought an analogue feel to my work on the flash. I love camera trickery really smoke and mirrors honestly shot into a lot of mirrors and right time, my episodes of flash and and I love it and that goes right back to the very beginnings of of moving making where it came from sort of vaudeville in stage the technology so they were doing magicians sawing people in half kind of gags with and what that was all brought into TV and I love that you know 120 years later I'm still we are still using smoke and mirrors. We can't forget that too. We've gone so digital fix it POST, PUT THAT flare and then post we're going to lose a lot if we forget where we came from guns a lot of texture.

Jeff Dwoskin 29:36

There's something about practical that just kind of gives it more of a warmth and I think in some cases, maybe challenges to people making it to to come up with something different and like we talked about how Spielberg kind of shifted in Jaws and that became something amazing like to me like the original Star Wars movies are great because it was so proud when they got to animated and to set special Back to the sort of lost, I think some of that the human aspect of it, and the charm of it, I love hearing that focus on practical, because you can tell you can tell the difference, it, it feels real, or you can connect with it differently. I think

Brenton Spencer 30:13

the big change for me in, we have to welcome change, and change, it's good while Texas weather was bad, then it creates the need for good, you know, that sort of dialectic continuum, we have to accept change, which is, for me, it was watching the movie Troy, you know, with Brad Pitt, and it was a shot, and Brad Pitt and all his glory on a balcony and the camera started sort of in a meeting close up. And he's just looks awesome. He could be here right now. And he looked great. Anyway, the camera pulls back in 1000 2000, Nana, and then it starts revealing the city of Troy to 2500 years ago, all the way back over the countryside. And I realized my God, the only part of that that wasn't an animation was maybe the count of 1000 2000, as we're pulling back, and then it's all digital. And it became this, this sum, this shift for me that movies are never real. But for all those things that you just said about the human quality that that we get in analog, by doing things physically, I thought that it shifted and we were going away from that. And so we I think we have to remember what you said we can't forget those. And we have to just remember the humanity that that that allows us and humanity does translate on the onto what we do films in art form. Do we do art every day? Well, we strive to, but we're artful most of the time, I know I am. And then sometimes we're artists. And I know those moments where I've let close up and the actors responding to the moment and I know that that's just as good as it gets. And every once in a while we have have a chance to light a scene shoot a scene that we know is in the world of art not of of the beige drudgery of every day of you know, pulling that of that load. It is what we do is art and art reflects humanity or not other people to view it but also the creator. So when we get away from the human aspect, it will it will affect us will change things.

Jeff Dwoskin 32:16

How cool is it to direct an episode in the final season, kind of take the helm?

Brenton Spencer 32:21

I was so fortunate to direct the episode that that I got on the flash, you're always struggling to put the camera in a different place to approach sets many years later. But really, that's just the state of mind because you can always find something new, something different something to change the story in a little perspective. But I was struggling with my episode, because I couldn't get the hook on it. I couldn't get the feel for what what it was. And I forget what I was watching on. Oh my god. Yeah, it was a John Wayne movie. It was his last movie was called The Shootist. He was very sick at the time. And I didn't even watch, I just scanned in the in the listings. And I realized that's what my episode is my episode was a Western. And I could approach it like Sergio Leone, and it was the good, the bad. And the ugly, it was the get a was the gang that couldn't shoot two straight, it was the guy that could shoot straight, it was Seven Samurai. And I had to get this group together. And I told them I'm going to shoot like Sergio Leone 18 millimeter and a 300 millimeter and everything will be wide, or be on all the detail of the eyes. And I said think of your your superhero powers like a gunslinger. And if you're talking to John core of your ice and your power is coming out of your fists treat that as if it's a gun is a pistol. And you know, in a western though, they'll show a cowboy move back to jacket to kind of reveal the gun, you know, and then there might be another insert of their hand maybe on the gun clicking and I said all that detail would do that. But we'll do it with your powers as if their guns and there's a beautiful sequence. Similar thing it's in the beginning of the second act, it's around scene 15 or something like that. When everyone gets together and then they get into their positions like is going to be a shootout and inside. Now let's work work as a team. I did something that I learned from a director work with years ago and I shot the close up coverage person for the master shot that works for lots of reasons. I would recommend any director not be afraid of it, but it solves a lot of continuity issues. But there's nothing like showing up at call at eight o'clock in the morning and having a 24 millimeter lens just stuck right in your face. Like this is Gotye baby. I like shooting wide lenses in close because I love the I don't want to ignore the fact that what I do is as a mechanical process, making movies directing being an actor, it's mechanical. There's a machine camera. I like the sense of feeling that I like like the presence of a of a camera not not physically moving around or let's advance the story, but just forever We want to feel for the actress to feel the presence for the camera operators theories, feeling the actors, and a wide lens in close gives a lot of feeling of a background to I loved it. It was great. And the character was I had a great editor. So you know, I couldn't beautiful story.

Jeff Dwoskin 35:16

How was it? Because you were part of that flash, CW flash family for quite some time. So it was kind of an emotional ending. I mean, like, I mean, just, I mean, just ending, right? I mean, just after being together for so long. I mean, you were where were you there five seasons?

Brenton Spencer 35:32

4567. I was in there Season Three as well doing second units.

Jeff Dwoskin 35:37

I mean, you were there almost practically the whole time. So the what was it like on the set was everything was kind of closing up. And people were saying goodbye. pretty emotional.

Brenton Spencer 35:46

Yeah, unbelievably. So in a way that caught everyone by surprise, except for Eric Wallace. He had a speech at the beginning of the season, they said, This is how it's gonna play out. It's the last season and the emotions are going to ride high in ways that you're not going to know you're going to be doing something or feeling something or frustrated by something or angry with something or happy with something. But underpinning all of that he said was the fact that we're saying goodbye. And this is a family, an emotional and intellectual investment. And it's going to it's going to hurt it's going to be bittersweet, and it was all of those things said that our extended was and then the coolest wrap party ever it wasn't you know, wild west sub barroom Brawl by any mean but just a really nice opportunity for everyone to thank each other. Oh, it was one of a kind experience.

Jeff Dwoskin 36:36

Sounds amazing 21 Jump Street time traveling for another one of your earlier ones. It's kind of like a classic show. I mean, it's such a was it was a Johnny Depp years or no?

Brenton Spencer 36:49

Well, some of them were I was the main unit DP on Season Five Johnny had left in season three and a half four and I'd worked on second units and and three and four were Stephen Cannell produce 21 Jump Street. JP Fenn, the producer of The Flash was the pm the production manager of 21 Jump Street.

Jeff Dwoskin 37:13

everything connects

Brenton Spencer 37:15

whole family of people that work on jump straight in and Wiseguy those I mean, Johnny Depp knew before anyone did really that you know, his star quality has potential and knew that he had to get out of there I think as quickly as possible in the company acknowledge that as well. super talented guy very, you know, you know, I was working on the second units wouldn't seem a lot, but a friend of mine had a restaurant that he would go too often at rap, so it would seem more there and he was just a regular guy. It was a good guy.

Jeff Dwoskin 37:49

Very talented, very talented. As we kind of wrap up, you've got a million things on your resume that are awesome. What what is one of the favorites that we haven't discussed yet, you might want to share a story from or I could cherry pick one.

Brenton Spencer 38:03

Well, boy, I'm thinking about a CTV and you know the two Koreas I mean, you know, Corey Haim Corey Feldman. We talked about First Blood

Jeff Dwoskin 38:14

about Stargate Stargate Atlantis, Stargate Atlantis,

Brenton Spencer 38:17

Earth final conflict that Gene Roddenberry and Rod Roddenberry and IBM good buddies. Very cool film experience I had was the making of crow's nest which was an indie picture and my writing partner now I don't write this the hardest thing to do by my partner my writing partner and development partner John Shepard has written everything we've done never cry werewolf, and, and closeness. closeness is one critic said is, is the best movie I've never seen. It was just this adrenaline soaked indie effort to create a very, very cool little movie that we had the tiniest the Microsoft cruise and we got it. We got to distribute it. We we got it up on Netflix. So I think the crow's nest was handmade. We did John's wife made some of the costumes and I directed and shot it and walked around with a jug of special effects beloved to pour on everything constantly. That's awesome. So crow's nest, closeness, put it all together in this it was a visceral experience.

Jeff Dwoskin 39:26

Okay, cool. Well, Brian, thank you. Thank you so much for hanging out with me. I really appreciate this. Other than Brenton Spencer films.com Where do you hang out online or do Yeah,

Brenton Spencer 39:37

I'm on Instagram, Breton, Spencer films, my website button Spencer films and I'm very proud of the the demo reel of the flesh of my work on the flash that I'm putting up there is like six years in 30 seconds,

Jeff Dwoskin 39:53

which makes sense because it's the flash so I have a short amount of time so make the entity

Brenton Spencer 39:58

required a one minute break. shouldn't but all the plans and flush them out that will be up any day. But I really encourage everyone to come and take a look. And you'll see the acrylic, the smoke and the mirrors that I think made the flash.

Jeff Dwoskin 40:11

That's awesome. I'll put links in the show notes so everyone can get to it or lazily. Thank you so much. This was amazing. I really appreciate you hanging out with me.

Brenton Spencer 40:21

You know, thank you so much, Jeff. I mean, wow, you're so easy to talk to and you do the most important thing. You listen. I'm just watching you're listening to so it's so cool and I'm on this on this ride. I know what I can see how you're reacting and being diggin one so thank you so much real pleasure.

Jeff Dwoskin 40:39

All right how amazing was Brenton Spencer so many great stories that interview kind of went by in a flash then it get it by bom bom. Right? awaited the whole episode to say that. Well, I can't believe it is over. Huge. Thank you to Brett and Spencer for hanging out with me. And of course huge thank you to all of you for coming back week after week. It means the world to me, and I'll see you next time.

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